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Patrick Fabian, who plays Howard Hamlin on AMC\u2019s <\/em>Better Call Saul, discusses how Howard\u2019s grief spirals out of control, his anger towards Jimmy, and his last gift to Chuck.<\/em><\/p>\n Q: Reflecting on the end of last season, where do you think Howard\u2019s head was at coming into this season \u2014\u00a0<\/strong>before Chuck<\/a>\u2018s death?<\/strong><\/p>\n A: Howard and Chuck have always had a relationship of shared manners. They both viewed the world in the same way: They were scotch drinkers, they knew who was in power, there was a world they existed in. When he dips into his own account and his own personal money in order to rid himself of Chuck, it\u2019s the equivalent of taking a sledgehammer to him. That means that what Chuck has done to Howard [hurt] him so deeply that he reacted. I think at the end of the season, there\u2019s a thought in Howard\u2019s brain of, \u201cOK, that was bad. It was terrible. I was saving HHM, but after six months, maybe cooler heads will prevail.\u201d But of course we never get that chance because of the events that occur. We open this season on the ramifications and finger pointing and who\u2019s responsible.<\/p>\n Q: What do you think Howard\u2019s first reaction was when he heard about Chuck\u2019s demise?\u00a0<\/strong><\/p>\n A: I think immediately there\u2019s a stab of guilt. What he says to Jimmy<\/a> and Kim<\/a> in Episode 1<\/a> is exactly what runs through his brain when that happens initially, but Howard Hamlin being Howard Hamlin, it merely gets pushed to the side because now there are things to be done. If indeed he\u2019s dead, which I assume he is when I get the call, then I need to alert a certain chain of people. I need to get to Jimmy, all of these things have to be taken care of. I already know that I\u2019m most likely his executor. I think Hamlin would go into work mode. Some people break down and they can\u2019t do anything and they can\u2019t eat. I think Hamlin would be the exact opposite. He would be responsible for things especially \u2013 and ironically \u2013 because Chuck would not be there to deal with these responsibilities. I think Howard would kick into care-taking mode as Howard knows how to.<\/p>\n <\/p>\n Q:<\/strong> What does it say about Howard that he does indeed jump into action at the scene?<\/strong><\/p>\n \u00a0<\/strong>A: Howard is a decent person. \u00a0I know some fans of Jimmy would beg to differ. In the end, there\u2019s a strong case to be made that Howard has tried all along to facilitate, protect and avoid all the drama that has been stirred up by the McGill brothers. Now, in this grave, awful moment, he\u2019s taking care of other people. I think, without a doubt, he\u2019s there to help. In a time of death, there are certain things that must be done and Howard is the man to do that.<\/p>\n Q: How hard do you think it was for Howard to write Chuck\u2019s obituary? Does Howard feel obligated to send Chuck off in style? A: It\u2019s fitting because they share a sensibility. Howard would know that Charles is a man of letters and of education and that he would not want sentiment or sympathy to be in his obituary. He would like it to be cleanly laid out so he could be judged by his actions and by what he did and the work he put in. If nothing else, Charles is all about the work and the law. Even in the scenes with Jimmy, he gives voice to that again and again. It\u2019s really what split us up in the end because he had lost that sense of the law and the correct way to see a situation. Howard\u2019s obligation is to reward him with a sober obituary. The beauty of the writing in that is, as we shot that, I very much felt that loss. I hated not having Michael McKean around and I hated having to read his obituary, but there was pride as Howard. It\u2019s my last gift to Chuck.<\/p>\n Q: As you mentioned, Howard obviously feels partly responsible for Chuck\u2019s death. What do you think he\u2019s actually hoping to get from Jimmy when he unloads at the end of Episode 1?<\/strong><\/p>\n \u00a0<\/strong>A: He\u2019s going there to take Jimmy off the hook in case Jimmy thinks that what he has done to Chuck in any way shape or form made this happen. The last time they really saw one another was in Episode 5 [of last season]<\/a> in the court room. When that goes on, there\u2019s every reason to believe that Howard thinks that Jimmy believes, \u201cI did that to Chuck and he killed himself.\u201d So, me falling on my sword isn\u2019t really falling on my sword. It\u2019s taking responsibility. It\u2019s not absolving myself of anything. Here\u2019s Howard once again trying to help out Jimmy. At some point you go, \u201cWhy? After all this time, why? What have I gotten out of it? A dead partner and a prot\u00e9g\u00e9 who left me.\u201d I sound like Howard\u2019s whining. [Laughs<\/em>] But seriously, come on!<\/p>\n It is a double-edged sword. He also confessed and of course what he\u2019s hoping for is \u201cOh, look at that. His eyes are watery. Howard\u2019s got a heart!\u201d That was a tough scene to do. On the day when we were doing it and [Jimmy] turns and says, \u201cWell Howard that\u2019s your cross to bear,\u201d you could feel even the crew get quiet. It\u2019s so awful. It\u2019s so hideous and it\u2019s sad.<\/p>\n Q: What does Howard make of Jimmy\u2019s reaction in that moment?<\/strong><\/p>\n A: At that moment, I don\u2019t think Howard is as concerned with Jimmy as much as he\u2019s weighing the fact that Jimmy just basically said, \u201cYeah, you killed him.\u201d He doesn\u2019t let me off the hook at all. All he does is confirm it. For Howard, it\u2019s like \u201cWell, sh\u2014t. What did I come here for?\u201d Howard\u2019s out of it at that point. I think he looks to Kim to see if he heard that right. Howard\u2019s adrift at that point.<\/p>\n Q: In Episode 2<\/a>, Kim unloads on Howard. How does he take that outburst? Does he understand Kim\u2019s point of view?<\/strong><\/p>\n A: The cake was baked with Jimmy saying it\u2019s [Howard\u2019s] cross and now here comes the icing in the form of Kim Wexler, my former prot\u00e9g\u00e9. Rhea Seehorn, we all know is a fantastic actress, and the reason people are rooting for Kim is because Rhea\u2019s such a great actress. \u2026 I get better as an actor every time I\u2019m in a scene with her and this was a tough scene to do. We recognized it was an important scene. She really dug into me, and I was truly rattled. \u2026\u00a0 It\u2019s a humiliation. It\u2019s the whole idea of that seat of power in that room. HHM \u2013 one of the M\u2019s is gone. Wexler\u2019s gone. The last time we saw her in that office, things were OK. Now she\u2019s back and it\u2019s a complete collapse. It\u2019s a bunch of loss for Howard. I\u2019m not saying that to fish for sympathy, but it really is. He lost it all in a lot of ways. Q: When we see Hamlin again in Episode 5<\/a>, he\u2019s a mess. How much is all of this eating at him?\u00a0<\/strong><\/p>\n A: Howard Hamlin\u2019s in the bathroom without a tie pin on. I think that says it all. Plus, he\u2019s at the courthouse. He\u2019s in the bathroom at the courthouse with a briefcase as if he has to work. He\u2019s the head of a law firm, but we\u2019ve only seen him beside people who are actually lawyering. He certainly hasn\u2019t done any lawyering whatsoever. I think the whole idea is that Chuck is gone, things aren\u2019t good, the firm has taken a hit in reputation when Chuck got exposed. This is the fruition of that. I\u2019m in the men\u2019s room, I\u2019ve forgotten my tie pin, my hair\u2019s out of place and I\u2019m going to appear in front of someone as a lawyer and a representative of HHM. The weird thing is also that I reach out to Jimmy again, sort of like a war buddy in a shared victimhood, like \u201cYou and I went through this thing. Come on.\u201d But Howard is completely disconnected at that point.<\/p>\n Q: How angry is Hamlin that Jimmy doesn\u2019t seem to understand his own part in making Howard feel this way?<\/strong><\/p>\n A: It\u2019s like an alcoholic or someone who\u2019s found God. I admit that I\u2019m seeing a therapist. For a man like Howard, it\u2019s a big confession. It\u2019s an admission that he\u2019s not in control. The fact that he\u2019s willing to open up shows me that he\u2019s like someone who\u2019s gotten sober and sees somebody out there. It\u2019s like, \u201cCome on man. Come see the light,\u201d but he doesn\u2019t even know what language I\u2019m speaking.<\/p>\n Q: What was it like filming a scene this year without your Hamlindigo blue suit?<\/strong><\/p>\n A: [Laughs<\/em>] Jennifer Bryan, our wardrobe designer, is so good and we talked about how casual Howard is at home. Howard pauses to put something<\/em> on. We both agreed that his idea of casual is still that the socks match the right shoes and the jeans are cleaned and pressed. This is only the second time I\u2019ve not been in a suit during the entire show. It feels weird to be talking to Jimmy and Kim and not be in a suit. That\u2019s part of my power. It\u2019s like my cape. It\u2019s almost heresy.<\/p>\n Q: Howard has clearly shown he\u2019s not just a villain. Do you think his journey this season will show that? <\/strong><\/p>\n A: So far, the reaction is that people like seeing these different colors of Howard and there\u2019s some sympathy, but it\u2019s begrudging. There are plenty of people who have no problem saying, \u201cI hope he hurts! I hope he goes broke!\u201d That\u2019s the great thing about being on the show. The writers have given Howard some new colors to show and we\u2019ll see where it goes from here.<\/p>\n Read a Q&A with Jonathan Banks<\/a>, who plays Mike.<\/p>\n Better Call Saul\u00a0<\/em>airs Mondays 9\/8c. For the latest news and exclusives,\u00a0sign up for the Insiders Club<\/a>.<\/p>\n
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